
This is from an interview with the Maestro that we consider to be exhaustive for a first approach with his Art.
QUESTO BIANCO MI SOLLEVA
edited by Michele Caldarelli
Question: With
regard to your artistic experience, wanting to begin a discussion starting
with a formal analysis of your works, could you explain the reason for the
total "white" and exclusive that you use?
Response: That of the "white" was not an experience begun
only with my arrival in New York, it grew in time and naturally, without me
even noticing. Still in Italy, I remember that in 1944-45 in Florence, I entered
a church that, unlike the Baroque churches in Rome, it was a of a simplicity
that I had never seen before, and, in addition, it was painted a greyish but
warm white, with golden frames. This first visual experience of "white"
stayed with me, and having returned to Rome, which presented itself in the
landscapes that I was painting. In these, the sky often appeared with patches
of white, but not intended as a colour variation; it was not a question of
clouds which in the background one cannot tell if they are white or blue,
but of "spaces" painted in white. This "white" mirrored
itself in the landscape as well, alternating the vegetation and all the rest.
But the most important thing is that then, being a figurative- abstract, I
painted some crucifixions and the "white" stood out once again more
naturally for the spirit of the subject. I painted Mary Magdalene and Christ
completely, or almost completely white. The "white" expressed the
her love toward Christ which was no longer an earthly love but a spiritual
love
Q. Since your
first encounter with "white" how has your partiality toward this
non-colour, absence, spiritual transitus grown into being the absolute protagonists
of your work and further, can we interpret your "white" as a reflection,
mirror?
R. Yes, white reflects any colour, it tints itself; regarding space
however, you cannot attribute ties since the mirror is an illusion of space.
Initially the "white" was tied to the subject in question, complementary
to this, then it became a support of itself, strength, without being tied
to anything besides its own energy. First the "white" was also correlated
to the other colours and therefore a colour in itself, later, absolved by
the chromatic relationship it became a "space" tied to the idea
of the infinite, free of relationships, "white" doesn't exist. The
"white" in my works, then was not born from a cultural thrust, from
having known before and through history who, how and why of having painted
the first painting completely white. I found out about the white painting
of Malevich only subsequently, the logic of the story entered my thinking
later, in 1956-57. Naturally I know that history passes on culture and the
wealth of knowledge but it is also true that if you exhaust yourself in the
citation, you mean and you give nothing; you must add something to history
in order to make it alive and continue. The first things I did without constructive
knowledge, but with the sense of this "white" and used again not
one but many colours even for the graphic. Precisely working with the print,
in 1955, I obtained a completely white one which I still have. Later it was
the abandoning of the frame of colours and of well-matured experience of the
American abstract expressionism. The "white" appeared to me again
without my looking for it, he presented himself to me. I remember that in
Pennsylvania I saw a lake early in the morning. The water was evaporating,
and the vapours and the waters united in a unique grey-white, separation no
longer existed. Referring to this vision, I painted my first white painting
and didn't think at all about Malevich. Then the white has never left me and
colours slowly have disappeared from my palette and this "white"
lifts me up and offers me ever more happiness in using it.
Q. In a "white"
way you related even yourself to the support of the canvas, eliminating the
frame, its perpendicularity and every one of its references of classic proportioning
to this.
R. Yes, I eliminated the frame and the classicalness of the form: the
"square". I elaborated irregular geometric forms giving continuity
to the first white painting realised, that of Malevich.
Q. In many of your
works there are homogeneous materials. Ropes, for example, give a value beyond
formal, even symbolic, attributable to their wound and spiral structure? And
the white?
R. I believe that these ropes make up the memory of my childhood, when
I was always on the seashore. My hometown is located, on the rocky coast of
the Tyrrhenian Sea, facing Stromboli. But if, unaware, I referred to memory,
my intention, in inserting the ropes in the composite space, was that of accompanying
the eye, in an elliptical rhythm, from the bottom to the top of the work,
and vice versa. Involving in this way, even the painted background placed
to the left and to the right, this line traced from the rope constitutes an
accent of the space, dividing it and uniting it at the same time. In these
paintings, to which we are referring, space was not yet understood in the
total sense, but was still tied to some actions. The rope, almost always oblique,
enters and exits from the canvas surface involving, in its movement, even
the internal space with that external. I have never given symbolic values
to my works, because I think that symbol does not exist, in the absolute sense.
Every culture has its own, and in the field of artistic impression, I find
that we are limiting. The same "white", for example, has contrasting
meanings for various people groups. If, in the classic portrayal, a symbolic
character was attributed to the images, I find that these would result as
more enchanting where the symbol remains definable as in Tiziano's "Amar
sacro e Amor profano". Here it one can not conclude if the profane is
the naked body or the dressed one, or vice-versa, and the interested in this
painting continues.
Q. But if you affirm
to not include symbolism, how do you justify the "mythical" sense
that is suggested by the titles that you assign to you works?
R. The first time that I used a rope was in the realising of "Dante's
Inferno" in 1964, placing it on the inside of vertical, box-shaped structures,
travelling the fluting, visibly from the bottom to the top. I started out
with the idea of raising a column from a platform placed in a basin of water;
I wasn't contemplating the idea of the title. When I finished the work, with
all of its 25 columns, I was living in Pennsylvania but had a studio in New
York. One day Barnett Newman came with my wife to visit me, they saw the work
and discussing it they asked me what title I wanted to give it, but they found
me unprepared. In creating it I had only thought of studying the effect of
the structures reflected in the water.
He suggested calling it Dante's Inferno to which I replied that it seemed
pretentious to compare it to a book that powerful. Newman replied, bewildered,
that I shouldn't worry about such thoughts, seeing that he himself had realised
works essentially entitled The Passion of Christ without there being, among
other things, any passion, or even less, Christ. The theme seemed tremendous
and, thinking about all the characters that Dante placed in Hell, the desire
flashed into my mind of wanting to, when I will travel toward that other dimension,
go precisely there because I believe that even Dante ended up there, and I
can also talk to Virgil, Socrates, Plato, Pythagora, and other great thinkers.
So I also gave a name to every column, but only to distinguish them from each
other. There are small ones as well as those nearly 4 meters high, of aluminium
and the rope is fused in metal. Certainly it could be that, unconsciously,
I had intended to evoke with names the "mystic" or "meditative"
sense which is normal in my practice of Yoga which I have by now practised
for many many years, but it remains ever extraneous to the artist's intention.
Q. For you, is
the formal approach in step with the joint-ownership and the elusion of symbolism.
R. Yes, after eliminating the frame, I eliminated the variations between
the various types of white and I used only one, that of titanium, the most
intense. Then, having limited myself to only this white I felt the need to
work further and dedicated myself to sculpture beginning with Dante's Inferno.
When sculpture was no longer enough, I concentrated my attention on physical
spaces and to making them come alive. I created one, for example, with some
trunks at the Hutchison gallery on Green Street in New York. With around 84
trunks painted white, arranged according to the classic perspective but with
an unusual perspective which disoriented the eye. There was no vanishing point
and in the end I had placed a "sacred" tree, as all nature is sacred,
which was the work's crowning moment.
Q. In the tree,
allow me the symbol, "wood of life", could again be placed as the
ideal "place of passing"?
R. Yes, in that time I was living in Pennsylvania on a large farm with
a lot of space, in a type of farmhouse typical to that area, which has a very
beautiful architecture. The view of the trees, bare due to winter and then
gloriously green left me a profound impression on me. From there came my desire
to use trunks for creating a never before seen nature. Even if the show whitens
nature, it always leaves some emerging parts with their own colour and a nature
completely enfolded in white, as I had wanted it, it has never existed, if
not by my doing. Later I used many other materials, including plastic, since
1954, and especially in the latest works, milk-white Plexiglas
Q. Like the primordial
milk sea of the Indian tradition? Should you allow me one final good-natured
provocation.
R. As you wish, but I say again that as each metaphor or symbol is
not a part of my artistic vocabulary, even though I wrote a poem about the
breasts which with milk nourish the world. Even in the use of the oval, which
I recently reintroduced, I wasn't trying to allude to the cosmic egg that
generated the universe, as much as, in the formal elaboration, I simply want
to escape from every reference from Cartesian space and to the harmonic configuration.
All that happens in the painting's surface or in the prospective illusion
has a symbolic value and therefore limits the artistic creation.
Q. Eluding every
metaphor or symbol, avoiding the returns that these bring about, is it therefore
possible to bring together tautologically, spirit from the material and material
of the spirit in that which you create?
R. Yes, I believe that, as an example in shaking someone's hand you
can perceive their "strength", even towards things, all things material
in general is established a relationship of profound contact, even only in
a visual touch. I am fascinated also by the idea of the non-existent "point"
where everything gets its origin (The uncreated-author's note). There is no
nature in the universe that is not made of non-material and the point is from
where originates the whole cosmos.
*(Interview published
in: "L'Arca", Milan, Nov. 1989, n32, pp.102-103)